noreen
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Examples?

topic posted Fri, April 16, 2004 - 4:33 PM by  Thomas
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Anyone else have examples for a nifty new micro-sub-sub-genre.

Múm and Four-Tet are canonical, of course and there are certain tracks that qualify by Manitoba, Fennesz, andreas tilliander, even Tortoise. My own work is increasing moving in this direction. The idea is not simple lush retro-ambient, but something that keeps a sense of clickedy-ness while bringing back prettiness and dubwise soul groove, instead of say Confeld or Kid606 pure glitched-out noise thrills. There's a place for that, but I want just a bit of twerkiness while still having music I can fall asleep to.

Still, if this is gonna be a, you know, movement, it needs more than half a dozen albums. Anyone come across anything that might count lately? Do please post, however obscure. Mp3 only counts as well, of course.
posted by:
Thomas
Chicago
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  • Re: Examples?

    Tue, April 20, 2004 - 4:51 PM
    off the top of my head right now ...nothing...but let me search my vast collection and I'll have a lot more to write tomorrow...guaranteed.

    -m
  • Re: Examples?

    Tue, April 20, 2004 - 6:17 PM
    There's this pretty obscure one-off collaboration by Lee Norris (Metamatics) and a couple of cats from Japan called Tone Language. The record was called "Patience Is the Key" and came out on Korm Plastics/Staalplaat a few years ago. I think this might fit in a way. It's worth checking out in any case. (Actually, come to think of it, there's quite a bit of Staalplaat material that might fit the bill. They put out a lot of ambient with some accoustic instruments involved, O Yuki Conjugate and such.)

    Back to this Tone Language thing. Some of it's obviously Oval-influenced glitched-out microlooping, but then it also has a lot of just wide-open Enoish lushness. All of it is really beautiful. It's still available from Amazon:

    www.amazon.com/exec/obido...005-1460129

    And there's some free tracks at Epitonic:

    www.epitonic.com/artists/t...guage.html
  • Re: Examples?

    Wed, April 21, 2004 - 4:32 AM
    You know, something occurred to me early this morning, after I awoke from dreaming that I had a pet bear. That is, I'm still hoping people will think of more examples, and post them here, but it's really all right if there aren't that many. Part of the idea is, is that we're here to make our *own* scene, eh? The examples are only helpful inasmuchas, for all my near-pathological verbosity, I'm finding what I'm after just a bit difficult to articulate.

    But it's like this: I'm certainly no McLaren impresario (and g-d knows I wouldn't wanna be) but before Malcolm McLaren, not that many people really necessarily saw any kind of line connecting the Velvets to the Stooges to the Ramones--and I don't think a single one of them would have drawn that line back to Duane Eddy, or over to political manifestos like Debord's. These were all just separate threads that McLaren wove together to like catalyse a scene, out of which eventually came the Sex Pistols who made it sort of clear to everyone how all this machinery worked together. And it was pretty dodgy at first, honestly.

    So now. Múm and Four Tet? Not a whole lot in common, sonically, on the face of things. Just two records I happened to find just as was needing some music that could excite with a sense of avant adventure, even as it soothes with simple musical joy. They both have done that, and gotten me turned on about this music in a way that I haven't been in a few years. So naturally, I jump over to same old emusic BBSs, and everyone's still talking about IDM and glitch and microsonic post-digital noise and whatnot and I'm like "I need something different to happen. Not the same old ambient, but something that takes all this glitch and does something *pretty* with it.".

    Well you know, I never wanted to be king of anything, and I'm still praying this little embryonic scene will take off and fly on its own entirely without me and beyond anything I can even imagine. But I always have believed in the punk thing of DIY and if the scene you want isn't there, it's up to you to make it happen. So this is me, givin it the best try I can. I hope you'll help me out. Thanks so much just for being here. I've gotten some words of encouragement from several of you that let me know that I am making sense here, and that helps a lot.
  • Re: Examples?

    Wed, April 21, 2004 - 10:50 AM
    Geez, there is so much to list, here are a few:


    Crunch
    Electric Birds (So good, so good!!!!!)
    Lucine Icl
    Todd Mullineux
    Jan Jelenik
    Farben
    Loscii
    Pan American
    Yagya (get "the rythm of snow" on Force, so beutiful)
    Vita
    Auch

    Damn, everyone above is just so great.

    The best music ever made is coming out right now...



    • Re: Examples?

      Wed, April 21, 2004 - 11:33 AM
      <<The best music ever made is coming out right now... >>

      This is very much my feeling as well, and a large part of my motivation for starting this tribe. Welcome to it, Lorin, and thanks a lot for the list. It has some familiar names, and some that are new to me which I look forward now to checking out.

      Electric Birds are quite good, although they borrow a bit liberally from Steve Reich (but then, who doesn't?). One thing that's totally unfair of me, but I've always been irked by them because I think their name is just sort of dorky. But it is really good music, though - I was just listening to "Panaorama" again the other day. I never really got to know them when I was out in Seattle, but they were sort of around, and seemed like good people, too.

      Anyway, nice to see you here and thanks again for catching the vibe..
      • Re: Examples?

        Wed, April 21, 2004 - 11:49 AM
        Ok here is my list......

        H.Amezquita-static discos label
        Fax- also on static disco's
        Murcof-also on static disco's
        Lucine
        Loscil
        electric birds
        Jan Jelanik + farben
        yagya (I agree rhythm of snow is beautiful)
        digitonal (from the U.K, checkout thier site digitonal.com)

        again thanks Thomas for starting this tribe.....let's keeping it going.... ;)

        -m
        • Unsu...
           

          Re: Examples?

          Sun, May 1, 2005 - 11:26 PM
          www.basswarp.com/guests/seedmix.mp3

          Sixty Seconds of Seed
          Compiled and mixed by Digitonal
          Mixed on traktor with a faderfox micromodul DJ1 and no edits.

          01. On/off - Distant personal
          02. Video age - Protect and survive
          03. Kansas City Prophets - Sheer
          04. Posthuman - Jacson of Israel
          05. Posthuman - Violence Presidential
          06. Ardisson - Yes
          07. Ardisson - Stop
          08. Ardisson - Stainless Steel
          09. Doubtful Guest - Untitled
          10. Kansas City Prophets - Detraffec
          11. Doubtful Guest - Untitled
          12. Digitonal - Cantus V
          13. Ardisson - Leaves
          14. Ardisson - Can you Keep Up?
          15. Moq - Untitled
          16. Posthuman - Two Brothers Fall

          www.seedrecords.co.uk/
  • Re: Examples?

    Thu, April 22, 2004 - 6:26 AM
    A couple observations

    - Yagya is indeed superdelicious, and on further investigation turns out to be another case where this tribe might just as easily have been named "Iceland Has All the Best Music". (Björk sure lurks unspoken behind this conversation, as well - if this thing gets over to the point where I'm ever hosting a Pedicel event in a local room, I'd want "Vespertine" in my crate at the very least.)

    - Contrary to what I said in the original post in this thread, this is not an exercise in genre definition at all. We are talking here about music that, thank heavens, resists easy genre classification. I prefer the notion of a vibe, a scene, or a sound. This sound can be detected in the work of certain originators and mutant aural cross-breeds who work outside established genre definitions. Then again, examples can also readily be found which lie comfortably *within* existing genres or subgenres, but in ways that cut across these boundaries. Again, at some hypothetical 'post-glitch' night, I'd wanna spin a lot like my webcasts have been. Given turntables, a mixer and sampler I'd want to have more cuts, crossfades, and layering than I can do with just an mp3 playlist, but basically you could expect a little of everything - from minimal techno, to ambient, jazz, classical, jamaican dub, neo-digi-dub, post-rock, what have you. And I wouldn't worry about beat matching at all.

    - Even if none of the above ever happens, even if I can't gather up enough original works to get this little netlabel started, this here little tribe of ours is already everything I was looking for. I remember when I first started it, this page came up with a message that the new tribe had to have at least three members to be listed in the directory. I was like "great. now what?" I mean, I started this because I was hoping to *meet* people, if I already *knew* them, what would I need this for? So it was kind of a crushing little moment. Just your all being here and digging this means more to me than you can ever know. Thanks so much.
    • Re: Examples?

      Thu, April 22, 2004 - 9:25 AM
      Erik Schoster does some really great stuff, both under his own name, and the moinker He Can Jog. Check his page @ schoster.cjb.net/

      Download the Labrabbit.org released 'We All Have Hot Chocolate Tummies' EP. Its all great, but the title track especially is fantastic.

      His stuff fits into the post-glitch vibe for me for sure. There are noise elements, smooth tones, and other sounds abound, but there is an underlying warmth and emotion that premeates everything he does.
      • Re: Examples?

        Thu, April 22, 2004 - 9:49 AM
        << 'We All Have Hot Chocolate Tummies' >>

        Oh, my sweet blessed toes.

        Best. Title. Of. Anything. Ever.

        Thanks for the tips.
        • Re: Examples?

          Fri, April 23, 2004 - 11:21 AM
          <<The best music ever made is coming out right now... >>

          yes there is a lot of great music out right now, but is it really the best music ever made ? i think that is kind of broad and oversimplifying things a bit aint it ? people have been making records for nearly a century and creating sounds since
          cavemen started bangin bones together .....


          what makes the music more important or greater than say what miles davis or brian eno did in the 70's ?....... a lot of the music today was influenced by what artists like those guys did ....
          i really enjoy music that melds the past with the present

          im sure people in the 70's thought that they were creating the best music ever too


          • Re: Examples?

            Fri, April 23, 2004 - 7:40 PM
            Because music is absolutley free of any stylistic contstraints now...

            Plus the availability and affordbility of music technology nowadays allows even the "bedroom" composer to create with professional results.

            And the ability to really, really create the soundscapes in your head with extreme resolution (48k, 96k, 192k!!!!!).
          • Re: Examples?

            Sat, April 24, 2004 - 3:55 PM
            OK, first of all, I can see we're gonna need to hang a giant "De Gustibus" banner over the front door to this tribe right quick.

            Right, then.

            That out of the way, the next thing I have to say is: resolution schmesolution! there's still nothing in the digital domain that beats a nice spring reverb and some two-inch tape. The supposition that advanced technology improves the state of music is a dangerous lie told by guitar-store salesmen with "keyboard" neckties. I have seen the desk King Tubby mixed Augustus Pablo's "Rockers Uptown" on in person; it had four tracks, pots the size of your fist, and generally looked as if it had been hammered together by trolls rather than assembled by electrical engineers. Some of the best tracks I've heard lately were played on old 8-bit digital machinery. My point is that the tools aren't what make the music - music is what creative people make with the tools they have at hand.


            I'm basically in agreement with dylan here, and I'll spell it out a step further: at any given moment, there's likely to be a great deal of crap music being put out, but also a certain amount of unarguably genius music - which is generally rarer and more difficult to find, but I think it's always going on somewhere. James Carr cutting Dan Penn's "Dark End of the Street" for Goldwax in 1966, Coltrane's "A Love Supreme, Minutemen "Double Nickles on the Dime", Autechre's "Amber". These and so many more are sort of unassailable moments of authenticity, originality, and sheer brilliance that simply can't be replaced or outdone.

            When I appeared to embrace the statement "the best music ever made is coming out right now" I guess I took it in a different sense. I did not mean to suggest that music of today is necessarily *better* or more important than music of any earlier period - jeez, a quick sweep of the radio dial is all it takes to dispell that idea in a hurry. I understood it to mean something more like *some* of the best music ever made is coming right now. Put in this way, I mean it's almost tautological. As I said earlier, there's usually something important (or that will be important) going on somewhere, the tricky part is in uncovering it.

            All that said, there does seem to me to be *something* more exciting going in the particular specialized realm of post-techno, ambient sorts of music in the last, say, two years, than had seemed to be happening since around 1998 or so before that. It seemed to me that from 98-02 there was a lot of fragmentation and experimentation - some of which was to the good, but most of which seemed to lack a clear direction or sense of purpose. And at this point, I'm not even saying that a single direction or purpose as such has returned to the stage exactly. But people don't sound as if they're thrashing about as much, struggling to find the groove. Acts like we've been talking about in this thread have got soul to spare.

            This is all very difficult to express, but it's like the best acts right now have stopped fretting over fitting into this or that category, and are getting on with their own musical lives. People are beginning to find their own unique voices again, in this sort of leaderless and almost rudderless miriad microcultural landscape. They've gotten over the fetishizing of technological process as an end in itself, and the sounds of that period become just more material to sample, while its particular tools (the DSP and the glitch) are just another choice, among many available, one might take if necessary in order to *blow* more clearly and distinctly. I suppose I too am talking about melding the past with the present.

            After having had a really hard time finding anything worth caring about in the whole "experimental electronica" bag, I mean I'm starting to get really *turned on* again by things I'm hearing. In that sense, the "best music ever" remark was just a neat bit of hyperbole for me to hang my enthusiasm on.
            • Re: Examples?

              Sun, April 25, 2004 - 8:22 PM
              Nu Skool Breaks is this shizit.

              Click-no is the shizit.

              Glitch house is the shizit.

              Modern Minimal Techno is the shizit.

              Clicks & Cuts are the shizit.

              Modern jam bands (particle, new deal, madeski martin & wood) are the shizit.

              And post-ambient-glitch is the shizit.

              Almost everything lumped under the title "post ambient glitch" is 100% laptop music.

              Churning, splintered psychedelic mindscapes piped through chains of VST's are the most interesting thing I've ever heard.

              I stand by what I said before "The best music ever made is being made right now."
              • Re: Examples?

                Mon, May 3, 2004 - 11:54 PM
                Glitch house is indeed the shiznit. I just got turned on to "Soft Pink Truth" by a friend of mine, and it is one of the coolest albums Ive heard. Groovy, minimal, tech house to take you there and back again.

                You guys can download it from my server to check it out before buying it:

                phase.vis.caltech.edu/Soft_Pi...u_Party/

                BTW, its encoded in OGG format, not MP3.
              • Unsu...
                 

                Re: Examples?

                Tue, July 13, 2004 - 2:30 PM
                Ripple is full of "shizit",

                If all so-called "nu-school breaks" atrists(yuk) and "modern jam bands" (jamming is another word for having no real ideas) collectively jumped off a tall bridge together... I would sleep just fine tonight.

                All these "genre" buzzwords are makin' me ill. An album made with a specific genre in mind is usually throw away shit to begin with. As if you haven't noticed, I hate the word genre. People who talk about music in this light are consumers and nothing more.

                ~soren j. freeboy
                • Re: Examples?

                  Wed, December 8, 2004 - 4:37 PM
                  if you hate the word genre, why are you dissing entire schools/genres of music? not to mention musicians who have the skill and chops to make music on the fly. Not to say that you have to love all that stuff, but... tipper is not "yuk" and phish's jams can get so deep and funky it's beyond "ideas" - that's the point.

                  but disregarding any difference in musical taste, there has to be a way to talk about types of music - hence, genres. It's just a way to categorize certain sounds and therefore be able to have a conversation about them.

                  And as for the consumer label - are we not all music consumers, listeners, and appreciators? I think that's the point of this tribe :-)
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
                    Unsu...
                     

                    Re: Examples?

                    Sun, January 16, 2005 - 7:08 PM
                    "Noodling" is for hippies. It's not a genre, it's an approach. And Phish is for the birds.

                    This strain of "electro-organic" music (as it's been called here) is all about composition, mixing analogue and digital mediums/instruments, and tends to adhere to the precepts of minimalism in style and substance. It IS wide open to improvisation, but, I think, in a very controlled manner, and the composer always has the opportunity to re-visit the improvisation and take what she/he wishes from it.

                    Not arguing, just hoping to spark some conversation.

                    respect.
                    ~Soren J. Freeboy
                    • Unsu...
                       

                      Re: Examples?

                      Fri, May 27, 2005 - 4:10 PM
                      ecause I don't just ran across this tribe...

                      jamming is just real time composition... and can be an excellent way to find ideas...

                      improvisation allows for musicians to interact with the vibe of their audience... as opposed to just projecting their vibe AT the audience...

                      I like both... but I don't like Phish... as I don't like earthy music...
  • Unsu...
     

    Re: Examples?

    Mon, April 26, 2004 - 1:44 AM
    um. solvent?

    am i way off? it's kind of pretty and electronic, but also sort of warm and human.

    i'm in way over my head here. but also sort of fascinated.

    i shall now resume lurking.
  • Unsu...
     

    Re: Examples?

    Mon, July 12, 2004 - 4:45 AM
    I'd have to say I'm more into the dub-tech end of things. Everyone should take special note of recordings from Berlin labels of the last couple years. I think the best record labels (easily) are there in spades.

    People I'm into (many of them friends of mine):

    1. Bus
    2. Fenin
    3. Donato Wharton
    4. Pole...although not a big fan of his last record on Mute.
    5. Triosk woth Jan Jenilek
    6. Chicago Underground Quartet
    7. Supersoul
    8. Al-Haca Soundsystem
    9. Lilienthal
    10. Deadbeat
    11. Burnt Friedman

    ---
    PLEASE let's stop thinking of it as a "genre". It's music...just music.

    ~Soren J. Freeboy
    alias Redhands
    aka Baby John the Baptist
  • Unsu...
     

    Re: Examples?

    Mon, July 12, 2004 - 4:48 AM
    I'd have to say I'm more into the dub-tech end of things. Everyone should take special note of recordings from Berlin labels of the last couple years. I think the best record labels (easily) are there in spades.

    People I'm into (many of them friends of mine):

    1. Bus
    2. Fenin
    3. Donato Wharton
    4. Pole...although not a big fan of his last record on Mute.
    5. Triosk woth Jan Jenilek
    6. Chicago Underground Quartet
    7. Supersoul
    8. Al-Haca Soundsystem
    9. Lilienthal
    10. Deadbeat
    11. Burnt Friedman

    ---
    PLEASE let's stop thinking of it as a "genre". It's music...just music.

    ~Soren J. Freeboy
    alias Redhands
    aka Baby John the Baptist

    PS- I have to say, as an engineer, that MP3's are shit. Period. Real recording artists can hear the difference. Just my humble opinion.
    • Unsu...
       

      Re: Examples?

      Sat, March 26, 2005 - 11:12 AM
      I think that we are really just hitting the tip of the iceburg in terms of indie/alt rock/organic/fusion sounding electronic music.

      For most of it's existence electronic music has been prodominately obsessed with sounding as electronic and 'trippy,' as possible... thus alienating most over styles of music. It has only been relatively recently that the indie and electronic worlds have even acknowledged each other... but now there is more and more fusion going on and it's fun.

      Yay for this stuff.
    • Unsu...
       

      Lilienthal

      Mon, May 2, 2005 - 10:30 AM
      Lilienthal is the shit!

      far too few have heard his music.
  • Unsu...
     

    Re: Examples?

    Sun, May 22, 2005 - 2:07 PM
    examples:

    stephan mathieu - sad mac, heroin, on tape
    ekkehard ehlers (marz, auch) - plays, Wir sind hier
    tim hecker - radio amor, mirages
    fennesz - venice, endless summer, live in japan
    move d - pop of dwoozle
    pete namlook - air, silence
  • Re: Examples?

    Sat, January 7, 2006 - 2:47 AM
    hey, good idea for a group.
    it does seem like a new movent or subgenre is forming

    how about The Books? a perfect example

    maybe Savath + Savales
    the new BOC has a lot of chopped up guitar

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